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Study Group on the Ideal of a Digital Transportation Society (3rd)

Overview

  • Date and time: May 17, 2022 (Tue) from 2:30 pm to 4:30 pm

  • Location: Tokyo Garden Terrace Kioicho 4th Floor
    Kioi Conference Seminar Room A (Online)

  • Agenda:

  1. Opening
  2. Presentation, Discussion
    "Utilization of mobility Liveable Well Being City Indicator from the Perspective of Well Being"
    Smart cities Institute Dear Mr. Nagumo
    "Architecture in the Digital Age - Directions and Empirical Analysis -"
    Dear Shirasaka, Keio University
  3. Future summary
  4. Adjournment

Conference Video

The conference is available on YouTube (Digital Agency official channel).

Materials

Relevant policies

Minutes

Secretariat: .

Then, Doctor, thank you very much. Murakami was supposed to greet you first, but I will omit that.

Chairman Ishida: seems to be late today, so I would like to start right away. I would appreciate it if you could tell me when you arrive.

You are participating from real and web today, and if you are participating, please feel free to ask questions and give your opinions on Teams chat during the presentation. I would like you to report at the timing of the question and answer.

Now, Mr. Nagumo of the smart cities Institute will make a presentation.

Member of Nagumo: smart cities Institute. Nice to meet you all.

My story is about the approach of mobility from the viewpoint of Well-Being, so I think I should say at the beginning that it is an outsider approach.

Please take a look at the next page. Based on the current situation that we have been talking about, we are working on various measures to include a Well-Being Indicator in Vision for a Digital Garden City Nation. We cannot move on to the next step unless you listen to what it is like, so I would like to use it to look at mobility.

In terms of the current situation, this was done by the IT Office of the Cabinet Secretariat at the time. The roadmap for mobility's strategies is in deficit due to the population and area. The current trend is to create strategies in three areas: rural areas, areas where travel by car is central, and areas where public transportation is widespread.

As for how to approach this, as it is circled in red below, it is arranged in the order of technology development, infrastructure, institutions, platform data, and finally social acceptance. I would like to say that I am entering from the opposite side because I am entering from the society side.

In the context of smart cities, not only technology but also zero carbon is growing, and I feel that we must keep this in mind.

The smart cities Institute is a member of 230 organizations in local government. Every year, we take a survey on what is being done in smart cities. mobility, which has two bars, came first in 2020, last year, and the year before last.

If we look at the world, which overlaps with the first presentation by Mr. Miyashiro and others, we will create a new paradigm by putting three things on one Obon: a return to the human scale called Walkable and Bicyclable, decarbonization and environmental coexistence, and digital. I think these are the prerequisites up until now.

From here on, the topic is about Well-Being in smart cities. I think it comes from the Sidewalk Labs diagram, and I add one layer each to the top and bottom of it. The digital and social capital layer in the middle is often talked about, but I wonder if it has not always been actively talked about how people who are beneficiaries of digitalization will receive it. I wonder if it is okay to think that people will be happy as a result of digitalization. I work in smart cities, and when I get home and talk about, my wife tells me what it has to do with my life. In other words, I think there are too many distances between technology and my life. So, I looked around the world to see if I could do something to visualization it. There were Australians and Finns who measured happiness and ease of living, so I made a Japanese version of it. validation smart cities

After all, the goals are happiness and ease of living, and we are doing smart cities as a means to achieve them. I think there are many places where mobility is also included here, but we must consider this composition first. This is a logic model.

There are various descriptions of this, such as economic prosperity and a life that is your own, but it is actually smart cities that is trying to realize this in a way that mixes economic value, civic value, public value, and environmental value. This is a little bit of formal knowledge.

Regarding the creation of indicators, there are two theories, Well-Being and Social Determinants of Health. You can think of this as the WHO concept used in the universal world, but Well-Being is a good situation not only for the body but also for the mind and society. Also, the health and happiness of people living inside will change depending on the environment around them, for example, everyone is wearing a mask due to the novel coronavirus, so let's see both from inside and from outside.

The World Happiness Report of the United Nations, as you may often hear, says that Japan is 54th. Why, even though Japan is a country of hospitality, according to their measurement method, the score of Japanese people does not increase. So, we thought it would be better to create a scale that includes a little more consideration and Japanese characteristics to measure our success, so we started creating an index.

The yardstick at that time is based on two things, Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs and the SDGs, and we are building a Japanese model in the middle. Maslow is physiological, safety, and so-called food, clothing, and housing from the bottom. Next, it is about recognition, society, and whether you have friends. I think you are lonely. Next, it is about self-realization and whether your dreams are coming true. At the top, it is about self-transcendence, and whether you are kind to others. It is something that you put in before you die. The World Happiness Report says that it is tolerant of others from the top, and it is measured by six measures. I would like to make it a Japanese version. The SDGs are from the environmental side. I don't see it in my mind. I am trying to make it a Japanese version.

It is a complicated thing to say, but to put it simply, it is a comfortable life if you have enough food, clothing, and housing. It is a good life if you have friends. Isn't it a meaningful life if you can make your dreams come true and be kind to others? I think it is possible to make a town version of this, and if possible, a mobility version.

This is the town version. If you look at the bottom, it says, "I'm fine." Next, it means that I'm satisfied with this town. For example, I love Kamakura. Next, I want my children's generation to continue to live here. It's the concept of royalty. Or, I'm the chairman of the PTA, but I'm involved in this town development. When I'm the chairman of the neighborhood association, I get a sense of civic pride. Before I die, I tell my wife that I was happy to live in this town. This sense of attachment is very important for Well-Being.

From here, with the help of various teachers, you have been creating indicators based on questionnaires and open data for the past two years. This is what you are working with Mr. Murakami to develop indicators in the form of Digital Smart City and Vision for a Digital Garden City Nation. If you look at them by color, the top one, in green, is Professor Maeno of Keio University. Ten Factors of Happiness in area. The orange one is Professor Yukiko Uchida of Kyoto University. Not only are you happy, but is the community all happy? Cooperative happiness. The middle one, Active QoL and Central City, is the performance of actions and satisfaction with actions. The bottom one, ease of living, comes from open data. To put it simply, what comes from open data is the reality of what is in the town. The middle one is the story of what you did there. The top one is hearing what you thought about it. The idea is to take this data and find out the individuality and happiness pattern of the town.

This is a detailed diagram. You can see this on paper later, but it is a question item. It says that I am listening to this because I am writing each question.

This is also what I heard in addition. There is a movement at the top of the gray, but this is also included.

When it comes to open data, this is what is included. I think many people feel that they have seen this somewhere before. On the far left side of the orange, there is the middle of physical health, and on the left side, there is "movement and transportation." Open data related to public transportation is measured.

In order to respond to this, we also take questionnaires so that we can measure whether the subjective and objective are in agreement or out of agreement.

In Vision for a Digital Garden City Nation, we are making it downloadable so that when we make it smart in each local government, we can measure our position and the results of what we are doing, so we are creating dashboards and libraries.

Next, it becomes interesting. There are various items from "housing environment" on the left to "accident and crime" on the far right. This is an item that we are investigating. We are investigating which items are subject and objective at the same time. They are put from left to right in order of correlation. For Japanese, the most vivid is "housing environment." Rent, the size of the house, and the housing loan come to us. We fly one and get a salary. But other than that, it is a feeling that mental health such as culture is the most important for everyone. In other words, can I learn what I want to learn when I want to learn? And can I meet interesting people? Diversity. And can I express myself? This is the basis of Well-Being for Japanese today. This is the lowest for Japanese in the "World Happiness Report." If you don't extend this, you won't be happy.

I would like you to take a look at the pink part. It says that "transportation and transportation," "nursing care and welfare," "shopping and eating and drinking," and "medical care and health," which are often seen in smart cities, are important. We cannot live without them, but they are not enough. Even if there are many of them, they are not as happy as they are. I think this means that the Japanese country has come this far. mobility is just around the middle. Without it, various things cannot be connected, so it is absolutely necessary, but I have the recognition that it is not at the top or the lowest.

This is a space, so mobility is also related, but the vertical axis shows how close to the city functions are and the horizontal axis shows how much space is available. Then, the upper left is the 23 wards of Tokyo. In other words, although it is small, there is everything, and as long as you have money, you can get anything. That is the life pattern. And as you go to the right, the space becomes larger, but the city functions gradually disappear. When you do digitalization, first of all, people on the upper left side will gradually move to the empty space on the upper right. People on the lower right side will virtually go to the upper right because they can get various services digitally. In other words, this approximate curve is falling diagonally down. I think you can see that Vision for a Digital Garden City Nation from the data point of view is becoming flat.

It's for each local government. If you look at the various characteristics you just saw in the basic local government unit, you can see this spider chart. You just have to look at the shape. It's in Chiyoda Ward, which is above Tokyo, and it has a very unusual shape.

It gradually becomes round in ordinance-designated cities. It becomes perfectly round in bedroom towns. This is a feature of Japan. It is a feature of the space where we live that from a distorted shape, it approaches a perfectly round shape even though the shape is small.

We hand out these dashboards.

This is based on the real data of a real city. Looking at this, you are using objective and subjective data on the left and right, and taking the results of a citizen questionnaire taken by the city on the vertical axis. It is subjective. Then, in the first quadrant, "environmental symbiosis" comes to the upper right. Environmental symbiosis is very important in this city. The "natural disasters" surrounded by a red dotted line on the right side of the vertical axis, are close to being missed. digitalization of these things increases satisfaction and improves the function of the city. That's why we are now doing something like this, which is a smart cities story.

From making a narrative and sharing it with the citizens, I would like to create a scenario in which I will be integrated with the happiness of the community without saying that I have nothing to do with the work you are doing like my wife. There is Maslow on the left side, and if you go from the bottom, it is an environmental symbiosis, a place with a very rich nature, so people who yearn for it migrate to it. Then, the joy of living surrounded by nature becomes really physically and mentally healthy, and the awareness of protecting nature increases. Then, you go to the pink zone, which leads to recycling, garbage collection, and citizen activities, which leads to the mayor's manifest, and if the policy works well, Civic Pride. From the outside, it is the brand of the city, and from the inside, it is the sense of community. Enhancing these things is Well-Being in smart cities, and I am doing this to find these things for each city.

Let's go to the area of transportation. I was able to obtain data on the world of transportation, so I would like to use it to apply it. At the bottom, traffic congestion, CO2, and stress during and other than commuting hours. The traffic condition index, mobility, and mobility, which include such things, include future expectations. I would like to take this data and try to find out if there is a correlation between quality of life and sense of happiness.

If you look at the upper right, it says what the correlation is between. The correlation coefficient between happiness and quality of life is 0.6, so there is a considerable correlation.

So, commuting time and quality of life are also 0.48, and they're kind of correlated.

Commuting time and happiness don't correlate at all. Commuting less doesn't make you happy at all, all over the world.

So, let's increase the data a bit. The traffic condition index, which is defined in various ways in the lower right corner, and the quality of life are 0.4, which is somewhat correlated.

Happiness also doesn't correlate at all with 0.05, so I think we can see here that movement is something that you have to put on to reach happiness.

If you look at mobility readiness at the bottom, if you include various expectations for the future, such as social impact, environmental impact, and economic impact, first of all, quality of life is 0.5, so it is correlated.

At last, the happiness level is 0.47. Therefore, I think you can somehow see that unless design is done not only in the place of moving, but also in the life and expectations that are attached to it, future town development and mobility will be boring.

This is what the story diagram shows. If you look at the bottom part, it is the yellow part. The minimum movement must be done because it is the foundation of survival. This has been done since the high economic growth. For what purpose is it because we go to the pink part and have the purpose of movement. Now, including here, we are saying that it is a platform. If we create a mobility that contributes to various ways of life and environmental coexistence that can reach more ways of life, we will approach the concept of happiness.

More specifically, I think that it may be more appropriate for the times to think from the bottom and create a lower mobility from the top. From the bottom, there are basic needs, and from the perspective of minimizing costs and risks, can we hit on diverse values, needs, and lifestyles, as well as universality and inclusion, or can we hit on environmental coexistence?

I have been looking around the mobility Plan for a long time. This green one is the mobility Plan. It uses the words "healthy," "fair," and "eco-friendly." Therefore, it is the mobility Plan, but it is close in the sense that it includes these words. However, there is no Well-Being. Therefore, if it is to be implemented, I think it is one of the proposals that Japan should create a framework that includes these words. I think there will be a sense of direction.

We don't have Well-Being yet, so if you look at the left side, the public transportation index, the QOL index related to mobility, and the sense of well-being at the top are collected in June, but we don't have them until then, so we look at them. The 23 wards of Tokyo, the correlation is 0.76. This is the place where the mobility is the most beautiful. The 23 wards of Tokyo is the only place in Japan where the quality of life is beautifully correlated with the quality of life.

Ordinance-designated city 0.5, it starts to go down a little. That's why the quality of life doesn't come together even if you increase your mobility too much.

The general city is 0.4, and I don't know much about it anymore. No matter which station you get off at, everyone has the same feeling. It means that personality is gradually disappearing.

If we look at specific cities, these are all examples of ordinance-designated cities, but if you look at the "public transportation Commuter Index" below in the form of a diamond, mobility is relatively well-shaped, and that's what business creation is, and the correlation between Fukuoka and startups is high. It's one pattern. In the middle is Hiroshima City, but none of them has much characteristics. When Hamamatsu comes, it's not public transportation, but the degree of car travel is increasing. Traffic accidents are increasing. That's what it means.

In the general city of Kamakura, public transportation is very developed. Although it is crowded, it is highly correlated with cultural creation. Odawara is in the middle and does not have much characteristics. In Aizuwakamatsu, diamonds are flattened as I said earlier. This is a pattern of dependence on cars. Therefore, it is said that it has been created by dividing into three patterns at the beginning, but even in the same general city, there are such differences. Even in the same ordinance-designated city, there are such differences. There are about three patterns each. Therefore, from the perspective of the quality of life, I think that the way of entering the city, what kind of traffic pattern it is, can be one of the recommendations.

In conclusion, I think it will be necessary to analyze Well-Being in the future. At that time, I think that Well-Being, QOL, and SUMP are urban planning for sustainability, but we need to prepare a meta-level framework instead of doing it separately with the SDGs. If we do this, Japan may be one step ahead of the rest of the world. If we look at each city based on the framework, we will be able to create a unique city. Thank you very much.

Chairman Ishida: : Thank you very much.

Greetings to Mr. Murakami, who has arrived.

Mr. Murakami: Mr. Nagumo is always working with us. In summary, it is infrastructure and connection. Without infrastructure, we cannot improve, and without connection, we cannot improve Well-Being. There are various analyses, so I don't know what the correct answer is, but I think these two are common in any analysis. I think mobility is needed at the very node, and I think we can wrap up.

As Dr. Shirasaka may have mentioned, in creating a new document to replace Public-Private ITS Concept and Roadmap, we would like to incorporate usability and the perspective of the user side into the roadmap, which has been relatively technical, and make it into a two layer form. At the beginning, I asked you to say that there is this research. For example, I think it is necessary for the upper body and the lower body to synchronize. In the same way that everything does not work unless the computer has a proper frequency to protect the clock number, even if we discuss it by sticking it together, if it is just riding on it, the upper body and the lower body are separated, and in the end, it does not become a kinetic theory, but it remains as it is.

In this year's roadmap, I would like to talk about how changes in what will be used and for what purpose will be synchronized with the technology that actually supports it on the time axis. I may not be able to break down tactically because it is the first year, but I am aware of how the time axis will be synchronized at the same time as bringing in the perspective of the upper body. I also talked about this at the request of Mr. Nagumo. Even if the government forcibly sets the time axis and draws a roadmap to work together, if there is no connection between the top and the bottom, the well-being of the people who are working on this will not improve at all. Therefore, there will be no movement to enjoy and realize this roadmap where the goal is unclear and there is no connection. What is not fun will not continue, and what is not continuous will not be realized.

As one theme of the second half of the workshop, I would like to see a discussion that will be added to the road map to date, while taking into account the perspective of the tactical theory of synchronization, the fact that the connection between us is not a visible motivation for the people on the ground who are actually responsible for it, and the perspective of the time frame that synchronizes the efforts of the upper body and the lower body, as well as the goal that can be used on the ground to support the connection, rather than being a motivation that only the experts in this workshop were excited about.

Chairman Ishida: , I would like you to discuss Mr. Nagumo's interesting presentation.

Member Koda: As you said, when creating a consortium, the idea of having only those companies with a large number of mobility industries participate is different from what Mr. Miyashiro said. If the consortium is centered on consumers, I think it is a feeling that facilities and industries that are often used by consumers will not be included in the consortium that properly considers this mobility. Thank you very much for your very valuable lecture.

As mentioned in the first report, it was very interesting to see how MaaS is linked to the level of happiness from the perspective of citizens, not just from a technical perspective. Although the "housing environment" shown in Slide 22 is the largest factor, I thought that "KPIs related to mental well-being," such as "diversity," would be replaced by age, life stage, and area. What is it like here?

Member of Nagumo: I think that is a very important point. Since all of this is done where data is collected, some are canceled out, and I think that there are places where the unevenness disappears from each other. However, it is said that Japanese people are globally low in terms of tolerance for diversity, self-realization, and self-efficacy. I think that this is not very different. However, I think that some fluctuation may occur depending on the area, such as housing being located in the upper part or mobility being located in the middle.

Member Koda: As you said, when creating a consortium, the idea of having only those companies with a large number of mobility industries participate is different from what Mr. Miyashiro said. If the consortium is centered on consumers, I think it is a feeling that facilities and industries that are often used by consumers will not be included in the consortium that properly considers this mobility. .

If I were to add one more point, for example, I would say that there are very few people who appreciate culture and art at home in extremely high places. So, when people want to place themselves in such diverse environments or want to incorporate culture and art, I would think that there will be correlations with mobility. That is what Mr. Nagumo said. It is not enough to just enrich mobility, but how these factors will be introduced. I think that is an extremely important factor.

Member of Nagumo: cultures, and the top one, self-transcendence, is altruism. The concept of sponsor. The second is artists who want to express themselves. Self-realization. The third social recognition is like wanting to go to a concert with your friends. I think the three patterns of culture and mobility correspond like a matrix in cross. In such a place, there is a story that the design will change depending on which layer of mobility you are talking about.

Hidaka Member: Thank you, Mr. Shirasaka JCoMaaS Hidaka.

I think it is a very wonderful initiative, and I would like to know what is worrisome or what I would like to know is that in overseas cities such as 15 Minutes City, it takes less than 15 minutes for one and the same transportation, and I think the answer is basically the same. As you mentioned earlier, there are cases in which the level of transportation access is different between Kamakura Station and Ofuna in the same city, and if we add this to the variation in one city, the average of our city is this, but the deviation is this high, and we can make up for the difference between good and poor cities. I think it can be used for a comparison between cities and Fujisawa City, which is next to Kamakura, and for a simple comparison with Well-Being, but I wonder if it will lead to an initiative to improve usability in the same area and to consider whether it is better to fill the mobility more when compared with neighboring cities.

In particular, compared to other countries, there is a large variation in Japanese transportation. As transportation develops in the private sector project, it is possible to run where there are many people but not where there are few people. I think the variation within the same city will be very large. In the questionnaire on general transportation, it is possible to divide users by distances from stations and so on, and as Mr. Koda said, it is possible to divide by user groups. I was wondering if this could be a very effective indicator for Mr. local government. Thank you very much for your very interesting presentation.

Member of Nagumo: data, and the open data is relatively limited to the local government unit. We will take the subjective evaluation in June, and we are planning to take it by postal code ward. Therefore, I think there will be such a difference between the Ofuna area and the former Kamakura area in the same city.

Chairman Ishida: In relation to the current issue, there was a major transformation about 40 years ago in which traffic behavior analysis and such things were changed from the road unit to the individual unit. At that time, we discussed this. It is quite a difficult issue to find the inverse correlation between the apparent correlation and the correlation of spatial aggregates on an individual basis, but I think it is really necessary to improve it further from now on, and I remembered a little bit after listening to your discussions.

Member of Nagumo: .

Chairman Ishida: .

Miyashiro Member: . Thank you very much.

I am looking at the 22nd slide as a basic slide. Among the correlations that are difficult to see, "medical care and health" and "connections with area" are relatively low. When I actually go to the countryside, I think that I am struggling the most. Even in the same town, people living in the center of the city are relatively active and want to have a certain level of connection. If they live in the suburbs and are scattered, it will be difficult to get to a meeting place, and the sense of connection gradually fades. Therefore, I think that there is a point where this must be reversed. I thought that it is necessary to take steps to increase the correlations and sensitivities. I would like to have some explanation, supplement, or understanding about this. Another point is that we have been in contact with elderly people recently, and in particular, with the spread of the Issue of health during the COVID-19 pandemic, health and happiness must be further improved. Regardless of medical care, I feel that health is widespread, and I would like to know what you feel about this while conducting research.

Member of Nagumo: Regarding page 22, we are not doing much more than this, but in relation to page 37, when I was talking about the structure of Well-Being related to mobility, I was talking to people who are actually running smart cities in a core city, and some of them are returning their licenses. They say that if they return their licenses, everyone loses their energy. In the discussions so far in mobility, we have been talking about ways to meet those needs such as automated driving, MaaS, and automatic delivery, but when I talked to those people, there was a debate about whether they would be opposed to it, and I thought that creating cars that can be driven by elderly people is the idea of Well-Being. Therefore, I felt that our perception of which side to look at and how to perceive mobility, which is also Well-Being, may be more important.

Miyashiro Member: As you just reminded me, I think it's whether or not there are options. There are automated driving and MaaS, but there is still a certain kind of pride that I can go to any place I want to go if it is close. Other than that, it is often said that there is a school bus running, but I can't get on it, so I wish I could go during that time, but I can't move. mobility is moving, but I can't choose it. At the same time, I feel inconvenient. Actually, I hear such stories when I talk to elderly people in rural areas, so I think I feel like there is a misunderstanding about that.

Member of Nagumo: Self-determination at the very top of Well-Being, the feeling of deciding one's own life by oneself, is related to freedom of choice.

Miyashiro Member: .

Advisor Mr. Ito: I would like to introduce just one example of a system of systems in as an exchange student, and I was curious about how the quality of life advocated by Seattle, Portland, and Copenhagen in Denmark is different from Well-Being. Seattle and Copenhagen advocate quality of life for the purpose of attracting people from outside. In short, I think they are advocating it with the awareness that by having talented people live in the city and making money by starting businesses, the population will increase, the economy will develop, and land prices will eventually rise. Which is Well-Being aiming for, the same thing or only aiming for people who live in the city now to be happy? In addition, in the real estate industry, there is a "Ranking of Cities to Live in," and it is noisy every year what ranking Ebisu and Kichijoji will be in. How does it correlate with such a ranking? I think it will be difficult to understand if Well-Being is far away from the indicators that are familiar to the general public, so I would like to ask you a question.

Member of Nagumo: .

As I said in the first question, I have lived in the United States for 12 years, so it is a model of capitalism. So, if you use market mechanisms to raise the price of land, it is the QOL for that. However, the implication here is that there may be a model where it is not the case. Talk about creating a community is not based on market principles. Market principles may help, but they are not the main purpose. Therefore, one point of view is that the perspective of who the community development is for differs greatly depending on the design of the regime.

In addition, there are various rankings such as the city I want to live in and the city I want to buy. I do backtesting on all of them. There is a correlation of 0.4 or 0.5. So, Hüseyin Tevfik Pasha, I'm saying the same thing. But I feel that the distortion is different depending on the mix of where the KPIs are. So I'm taking a very wide range, and depending on the needs of the city, I can make a selection when I want to see this part of the whole. And the difference is that the subjective view is paired.

Advisor Mr. Ito: I would like to introduce just one example of a system of systems in .

Member Momota: In the sentence of Otsu on page 2 of .

Thank you for giving me a complete understanding of LWCI.

I received your impression and excellent materials in advance, and I made a proposal. In the target area of smart cities, time is always the limit, but in fact, there are many demonstration sites in smart cities, so it is difficult to move and traffic digitally. It is the blood and blood vessels of society as a whole, so it cannot be done by itself even if it is called Dokan. It is very difficult unless society as a whole is changed.

In addition, as Mr. Murakami said earlier, when we talk about how to synchronize the upper and lower body of the roadmap, I think we need another platform. At present, we want to have the middle of the evaluation of technical requirements and basic requirements and the evaluation of QOL, as is the case with automated driving Level 4 and Eiheiji-cho, but we don't have the middle, and I think it is LWCI. To be more realistic, to be specific, first of all, we don't have a grasp of the current transportation situation in municipalities, including Eiheiji-cho, and there are bus, railway, private passenger transportation, care taxi, and transportation service for supermarkets and drugstores, but we don't know how to summarize them, and since last year or so, the Ministry of Land, Infrastructure, Transport and Tourism has been saying that regulation will be eased, please speak up, but I think there are very few local government that can move voluntarily. In that state, automated driving, complete Level 4, 3, 2, sharing, and venture business talks come suddenly, and we get confused. To be honest, the current LWCI talks don't seem to be linked.

Therefore, what the Platform and I said is to simply make it easier to understand how people's flow and distribution will change before and after, first of all, understand the current situation, and it is more like a guidebook. There is something that can be downloaded by everyone, and for example, NTT and other companies can use simple devices that allow you to see before and after the story of people's flow, which can be used by everyone, preferably for free by municipalities. We show what we call evidence-based policy making, and we leave it to each local government to decide how to apply it to residents. We may be able to apply it to grandparents at classes on how to ride buses and transportation, and to connect legal, technical, and Well-Being. Now, I feel that we need a common recognition platform for such transportation platforms.

Member of Nagumo: digital twin, and recently, the metaverse is close to it.

Member Momota: In the sentence of Otsu on page 2 of Yes. I wonder if we need something that can simulate and everyone can talk with the same parameters in common.

Member of Nagumo: or manga.

Member Momota: In the sentence of Otsu on page 2 of ?

Member of Nagumo: I thought the same thing. I wonder if it is always supply first. Innovation type.

Mr. Kawabata: The term " I heard it with great interest. In particular, I think that indicators are difficult to understand. I was asking because I thought it was important to be able to measure indicators such as the degree of happiness. At the same time, as mentioned in today's discussion, I was asking because I thought that after all, KPIs can be set to a certain extent, and how to set KGI is very important. Earlier, I heard from a member who has experience of studying abroad and living in the United States. In the United States, based on capitalism, it is considered true that there are jobs and land prices are rising. The setting of KGI is really very clear. I think it is very easy to set and use KPIs in such a situation, but I thought that it is necessary to clarify where the goal is, what kind of town the local people are aiming for, and what kind of livability they are aiming for.

In the European countries, such roads are created by residents' agreement. For example, in each basic local government, even in villages, such roads are created by voting. So, for example, in small towns, how do they decide on the residents' agreement to make urban roads a play road? When I interviewed them, they said that if you can write letters, all the people living on the road would vote. Children under elementary school age would also vote. We came to the conclusion that the goal can be set because democracy is developing so much. Then, there is a debate over whether Japan can do it, so it is possible that the European model cannot do it. Then, depending on how Japan sets the goal and how KGI is created, I think that the use of KPI can be very effective, but I thought that KGI is very important and that we should discuss where to aim. If any of the committee members actually have a sense of temperature about this, I thought it would be effective to put it on the desk.

One more point. With regard to the proposal that Mr. Momota mentioned earlier, I think it would be fine to look at travel on a 5-minute mesh. For example, in the case of European cities, there are cities where the goal is to make it possible for all residents to access public transportation in less than 5 minutes. If you look at travel on a 5-minute mesh, you can see that there is a depopulation of travel, so I think you all realize that it is important to create demand for overcrowded travel. At the same time, if there is a depopulation, you can give up public transportation and create the first transportation system like telematics, so I thought it would be good to proceed with such technical discussions. There are two completely different points, but if possible, I would like to ask for the opinions of the members. Thank you.

Member of Nagumo: I would like to return just one point, and that is exactly the case. In the end, when it comes to quantitative data, we will reach the point where value judgments must be made. So, speaking of the political world, the language may be too strong, but what should be considered as the priority values? I just mentioned an example of environmental coexistence, and when I look at the data, it is selected by citizens. It is like air, so it is not very much in language, but I think one approach is to make people aware of it from the data. However, I think you are right that it will take time.

Chairman Ishida: This is a very important proposal, and I am very grateful for the high expectations. In fact, I have been conducting national living indicators and life satisfaction surveys since the time of the Economic Planning Agency for about 50 years, and I was wondering what the difference was while listening to the presentation. Until now, I feel that the main focus was on operational modeling of what would happen to such indicators when such measurement actions were taken. However, as Mr. Nagumo said in his presentation today, it was extremely difficult to be persuasive with low correlation, and it was difficult to connect with it.

However, like Remix, which Mr. Miyashiro reported at the beginning, it has become possible to visually show such detailed data, what will happen to each other, and to include simple simulations in it. I think the concept of modeling, operability, and consensus building has changed greatly. We are in a situation where we need to change, so from that perspective, I was very grateful for today's presentation, and it was a reference. I would like to argue in our report that we will put it into practice in a place like KGI, or government, or something like that. I would also like to hear ideas for that from you. I think it has changed a lot and examples have emerged.

Miyashiro Member: KGI because it's related to healthy life expectancy and health. For example, healthy life expectancy has been extended by more and more people going out and doing various activities. Up until now, we've been looking at the world of average life expectancy, but healthy life expectancy and health have been increasing, and I'm glad to hear that. On the other hand, from the perspective of local government, medical care and nursing care costs will be decreasing, so we can see the economic plus side. In addition, I just mentioned that I want to drive by myself. For example, I think it's one way to create a town where driving life can be extended.

I can't see my health well, but it's easy to hook up. To tell a very symbolic episode, when I went to a rural area in Chugoku Mountains, I was talking with a 92-year-old grandmother. When I asked her what she was looking forward to these days, she said that once a month she would have a cooking competition with young mothers in their 30s. Using local materials. At that time, she said she was so excited that she couldn't sleep from the previous day, but a certain kind of excitement after waking up in the morning was like a KPI. But I remembered and thought about what the goal was, or maybe a health indicator for the area would be like a goal.

Hidaka Member: Thank you, Mr. Shirasaka Kawabata, I think that it is based on what actually happened in KGI in the city. I believe you have examples. When we conducted KGI in Kaga City, Ishikawa Prefecture, the population of the city, which is a city with a possibility of extinction, will decrease rapidly. That is, more and more people will die, and more and more young people will move to the city. After investigating the factors behind this, Mobility as a Service is a service, so I asked the residents what kind of Issue there is, not only for those who use transportation, but also for those who do not use transportation. As Mr. Koda announced, it is a city of about 200 square kilometers, so it will take about 30 minutes to get to the station. Then, one of the major reasons was that I could not become a regular employee and could not work overtime even part-time, so first of all, demand transportation for the elderly was good, but if I could manage from there, young people might move to the city, and the population outflow would stop. I believe that this is also the decision of the head of the prefecture, but I think that if such actions against KGI accumulate, I would like to see them return as a measure to raise Mr. Nagumo's Well-Being. I believe that the previous case may not be such a special case, but I think it is effective to collect such things from various area.

Member Koda: As you said, when creating a consortium, the idea of having only those companies with a large number of mobility industries participate is different from what Mr. Miyashiro said. If the consortium is centered on consumers, I think it is a feeling that facilities and industries that are often used by consumers will not be included in the consortium that properly considers this mobility. The idea of determining one KGI is probably an idea of Showa, and KPI is probably a solution to whose Issue at the head level is. For example, although it is not the same as mentioned earlier, it is good to have such a KGI to solve the Issue of child-raising households, and it is good to have such a KGI to solve the Issue of the elderly. Digital can be used now to properly analyze the Issue. In the past, when we thought about an analog transportation society, it was probably the public to provide services to the majority. However, if digital analysis is done properly, targets are set in detail, KGI is set for each target, and whether Well-Being can be achieved by achieving them will lead to the ease of living of residents in the town, the inflow of child-raising households, and the extension of healthy life expectancy. In the future, when the government considers major measures, private sector will provide such a variety of services, and the government will set a budget for them, or the head of local government will adopt such private service at his or her discretion. Otherwise, I think that the only one mobility service and MaaS can no longer achieve ease of living.

Mr. Kawabata: The term " automobile industry, if we try to provide MaaS across the board, it will not be profitable at all. I think those involved are aware of this, but in that case, I think we should analyze how to solve the problem from which Issue, how to look at it in terms of time rather than priority, the order of solution, and how the solution will affect the next Issue.

Member Koda: As you said, when creating a consortium, the idea of having only those companies with a large number of mobility industries participate is different from what Mr. Miyashiro said. If the consortium is centered on consumers, I think it is a feeling that facilities and industries that are often used by consumers will not be included in the consortium that properly considers this mobility. , it may be difficult to respond to the needs of residents with a sense of speed.

Mr. Kawabata: The term " In addition, as I said earlier, healthy life expectancy is not only physical health but also mental and physical health. The main keyword is mental satisfaction. For example, I like cars, so if I am told that I cannot drive, my life will end from there. I have already heard that I am returning my license, and I have already thought so. So, I think that the balance between these points should take into account not only physical but also mental aspects.

Katsumaki Member: I am encouraged by the fact that there may be various KGIs and KPIs, but I have seen a graph in which the travel distance per person and the national GDP are very clearly correlated and arranged, and movement does not add to the dissatisfaction. To tell the truth, people who are moving quite a lot are highly satisfied. I don't have any complaints. People who are not moving can't move because they don't have any means. Now, there are various things such as smartphones, so how many people in such cities are moving? The people in Tokyo are moving about how many kilometers per year, and the people in the countryside are moving about how much, and I wonder if there are complaints about them. I have been thinking for a long time that such numbers would not come out, but especially recently, logistics, e-commerce, and other goods are moving, and people are not moving. There is such a tendency in the COVID-19. I think there are some areas where I am a little dissatisfied. I want to move more. I think I can obtain more data on those areas.

Member of Nagumo: data, including the fact that there are limits to what can be obtained from so-called open data, we are collecting data on a basic local government basis, and we have asked Mr. Murakami to collect all the data from each ministry and agency. I wonder if there is any such data. In addition, in open data, another new dimension has been added this time. We have decided to make the subjective survey results open. What remains is the level of private sector. If we can share private sector data that has not been opened, more detailed and interesting data will come out.

Mr. Kawabata: The term " Also, I think that the degree of happiness is very different depending on the travel you have to do and the travel you want to do. For example, if you don't want to go to work but are moved, your happiness will not increase even if it takes 1 hour, but if you are going to your favorite concert, your happiness will be high. Such a thing must happen.

Chairman Ishida: A long time ago, the University of Tsukuba conducted a fairly proper survey to see the correlation between mobility, health, life satisfaction, and happiness among the elderly in Tsukuba City. What was surprising about it was that the distances traveled, the range of travel, and the frequency of travel were not very correlated. The reason why the correlation was the highest was the large number of types of purposes for travel. That was related. Therefore, I thought it was important to provide mobility in such a way as to how much freedom one can travel other than mandatory travel.

Also, at that time, there was a method called the Roken method by the Institute for the Study of the Elderly in Tokyo, which measures the health and activity of the elderly. Even such a proper scale does not work, and only seriously ill people can be detected. I wish there was a better method. If anyone knows it, I would appreciate it if you could tell me.

Advisor Mr. Ito: I would like to introduce just one example of a system of systems in I always stick to specific and easy-to-understand things, but I think the current situation in Japan, where there is too much concentration in Tokyo and no progress in dispersion to the countryside, is quite far away from the United States and other countries. Capitalism is certainly fundamental in the United States, but land prices in Silicon Valley and Seattle, which had developed greatly in the past, have risen too much and are now difficult to live in. As a result, people are gathering in other cities, and startups and large companies are starting to set up offices in such new cities. On the other hand, although some changes have been made due to the novel coronavirus, it is actually difficult for people and capital to gather in Japan unless it is in Tokyo. When I return to the town where I was born and raised in Osaka Prefecture for the first time in a long time, there is almost no change from the past. I think that there has been almost no investment until now.

Mr. Koda is right that KGI should be set for each area. However, facing the current situation in which decentralization is not advancing at all, I think it is necessary to have a perspective that how to promote decentralization and each city will develop firmly and have global competitiveness. I don't think the message of let's be happy by maintaining the status quo will be persuasive. I think that the authority of the government is also too concentrated in the center, so I think that the authority should also be decentralized so that it is easy to color each city, for example, entertainment in Osaka and food and agricultural products in Sapporo. If such coloring can be done, people and companies in the field will gather and investment will be made.

Chairman Ishida: time, so Mr. Shirasaka, may I have your presentation?

Shirasaka: Is it the Keio University.

As a self-introduction, I am thinking about architecture under Director Saito, who is right next to me. I originally specialized in architecture, and I will talk about architecture in the first half. In the second half, the Secretariat said, "Could you analyze Sakaimachi, which was presented by Commissioner Hashimoto at the first meeting, and make use of successful cases to create a base that can be used throughout the country?" So, I analyzed the cases. So I will talk about what it is like later.

When we talk about architecture, the word "architecture" comes from, of course, architecture as a building. However, the architecture we are talking about now is a little more generalized than that, if you call the so-called thing that is made up of multiple things a system. A system is made up of multiple things, and because there is a relationship between them, it becomes a system, so the relationship is called architecture, so we call the system architecture an architecture. So, if the system is IT, it becomes an IT architecture, and if the system is a business, it becomes a business architecture. Please think of it as a principle that if it is a city, it becomes the architecture of the city.

Then, a system is composed of multiple elements, but in the end, the reason why we have to do such a thing is that we have to take a systematic approach. Even if we look at it only in a small range, it will not be as we expect because it will be affected by others. Therefore, it is necessary to take a certain range as a whole, which is the definition of system thinking. It is defined as having two viewpoints, which are to take the whole and to take the relationship. A system approach is to use it for a certain purpose. This is the definition of words.

What is actually difficult here is to take a bird' s-eye view of the whole. It is easy to say in words, but it is very difficult to do. Then, how is it said in the world? This comes from research on ontology theory, but it is said that if you look at it from three axes, it is not much different. One is exactly what I talked about today, which is that we must take a bird' s-eye view of time. It is wrong to cut out only a certain timing, and it is wrong to consider everything from the beginning to the end, especially disposal. The other is a bird' s-eye view of space. It is wrong to look at only the object, and if we do not look at the surrounding area, we will be affected by the surrounding area, so let's think about it as a set with the surrounding area. Another is that this leads to Mr. Nagumo's point, which is called a bird' s-eye view of meaning, but let's think about what we will do for, what we will do, and how we will realize it as a set. So, it is wrong to say only the means, and it is wrong to say only what we will do, but it is necessary to know what we will aim for, and I believe that this is exactly where Mr. Nagumo's presentation earlier will lead to the purpose and what we will make Why.

Then, what is architecture? It is written in JIS and various other books, but to put it very simply, when there is a purpose, how to realize it. It is simply that. Therefore, if you have an image that how to realize is architecture, there are many things to be said in detail, but it is easy to understand if you think like that. Therefore, I often say that it is a mechanism or mechanism to realize the purpose. Actually, there are various things such as what the principle is and what the nature is, but basically, it is okay to understand it as a concept of a mechanism or mechanism.

In short, there is a purpose, a mechanism to realize it, and a means necessary for that purpose. I usually write the means in squares, so I call them round, triangle, and square. The purpose is round, and the mechanism or mechanism in the triangle to realize it is the architecture. Therefore, a means for that purpose is necessary. Of course, it cannot be realized unless some means is used, so it is realized by combining some things. However, this means is rapidly changing depending on the era. When this means changes, the purpose that can be realized eventually changes. You can do more and more things that you could not do before. To put it very simply, for example, if the number of ingredients for cooking increases, the repertoire increases. Therefore, the purpose of making meat changes between the era when we did not have meat as an ingredient and the era when we had meat as an ingredient.

The argument here is that we now have digital. So, the word DX is often used, but if you look at it in circles, triangles, and squares, even in the age without digital, we originally realized some purpose by using some means. Transformation to digital, which is not a very good example, is very simple, for example, replacing paper with electronic or e-mail. However, the essence of DX is not that, and since new digital has emerged, it has become possible to set purposes that could not be done before, and it has become possible to realize those purposes, so it has become possible to do things with completely different purposes. This is transformation, and it is digital transformation that is using this in digital.

However, the difficulty is that if something like the one in the lower right that originally existed now exists, for example, if it is replaced from paper to e-mail, it has the current method and mechanism, and if the mechanism is changed to e-mail, what needs to be changed is considered. But if a new purpose is set, it is necessary to consider what means and how to combine them to realize this. It is very difficult to think about the mechanism to realize the new purpose. For this reason, the concept of architecture is important. Thinking about the architecture here is also done in various places, such as setting the purpose and thinking about the architecture in DADC.

So, you are talking about the advent of digital technology. What kind of era is Society5.0? From the architecture side, this is Society5.0, which the Cabinet Office is talking about. It is human-centered, that is, by setting human-centered as a purpose, it is possible to realize this through the advanced fusion of new cyber and physical technologies. The purpose and means are written as a set. That is the definition.

In fact, even in the age of Society4.0, there were both cyber and physical systems, so it is not that there were none. Then, what was different was that in the 4.0 s, it is said that people intervened between them, and it is people who input physical information into the cyber world, and when a route is searched, for example, it is people who drive the route as searched. Therefore, it is people who act on the physical from the cyber. In the 5.0 s, there is no need for people to intervene. Cars automatically move based on the results of calculations automatically taken in by sensing. This becomes unnecessary for people. Then, it becomes possible to repeat it round and round in between, and AI is on the cyber side, so it is learned more and more, so it evolves on its own.

There is another thing. Originally, cyber was connected. It was originally connected. What happens when physicality is fused there is as if the physical space is linked by itself. For example, when you make a reservations at a hospital, a car will pick you up in time for the reservations time. If there is an accident and traffic jam on the way to the hospital, the delay time will be conveyed to the hospital, and the order of waiting at the hospital will automatically change. Then, the person behind you will be able to go first. Then, as a society, there will be no waste. At first glance, it seems that the physical space in which we live is linked, but thanks to the connection of cyber, it will be possible to merge cyber and physical. mobility, health care, and hospitals like this still exist, but they are not connected. This kind of system created by completely different people is called a system of systems.

I would like to introduce what is different from the ordinary one, taking a handbook published by INCOSE as an example. In this figure, on the left side is the Canon EOS, and on the right side is the HP printer. The Canon EOS is also a system. The HP printer is also a system. So, if you think about taking photos with the Canon EOS and printing them with the HP printer, what is this? This is a system, but it is a form of a special system called the System of Systems. What is different is that what is very easy is that when it doesn't work, you don't know who to complain to. In other words, when you connect the Canon EOS and the HP printer and print them, it didn't work. In this case, the user doesn't know at once whether the Canon is bad, the HP is bad, or the cable connecting them is bad. In other words, at the System of Systems, there is no one who guarantees the overall quality.

In an ordinary system, someone is responsible for ensuring quality. It is natural for a camera to work properly with a camera and for a mobility to work properly with a mobility. However, what will happen to a connected society is that things created by completely different entities are connected, and there is no one who guarantees the quality of the whole thing. There are many systems of systems like this these days. Standard interfaces are specified between connected systems, and if something matches the interface, it can be connected on its own. In fact, smart cities is one of them, but smart grids and Industry 4.0 are such systems. All of these systems have such characteristics, and in the end, we are in an age where we use mechanisms that are not guaranteed of quality end-to-end. So, we have to do various things with this, but it is not that this is useless, but we are trying to create new human-centered value by making the most of this. Of course, I have an image that we are trying to fill in the negative parts with some kind of hand.

In my image, when I think about making a reservations at the hospital, getting picked up by a car, driving to the pharmacy, and then going to the pharmacy to get the information, I think about the user, not to mention individually, and think about the hospital as much as possible, the experience as much as possible, or the journey. mobility is making it in mobility by thinking about people a lot. Pharmacy and supermarkets are doing it. However, it is not a single system, but what is connected is that people use it cross-sectionally, so it is necessary to match it. For example, as in the example earlier, people use the hospital, the mobility, and the pharmacy sequentially, not separately, so it is necessary to connect them. If we create value in such a system, we will be able to make it more human-centered.

Therefore, the way of moving differs depending on the person, so we have to work on what is connected to what in a way that suits the person, and various things will be connected. As Chairman Ishida said earlier, this mobility can be used for various purposes, so it will be connected to various places. In the end, if we are to realize this, everyone has been optimizing themselves vertically, but instead, customers move horizontally, so we have to cut them horizontally, and we have to change the mechanism of the industry itself.

In the past, for example, in mobility, there was a cooperative areas called a road, and cars ran on it. But in the future, using mobility, what kind of service should be provided to whom and where should be taken, and what kind of efficiency should be provided to Ukami. If we are to compete in a completely different place, the upper part of competitive areas and cooperative areas, such as the data business, will change. Therefore, it is Issue's recognition that we must switch from the past to cooperation and competition. Therefore, DADC is trying to make competitive areas and cooperative areas design again. This is being discussed in terms of architecture, and it is said that the city in the age of new digital connectivity must be considered from a slightly different perspective than before.

So far, I have been working on a general theory of architecture. From here, I will analyze cases that I forced to create. I am really doing it on my own. However, implementation is progressing very well in Sakaimachi, and in order to make it possible to do it in other regions, I am analyzing it from an architectural perspective while imagining what is causing it to be successful. I think there are inaccuracies because it is only public information and committee information. However, I have an image that it can be used as a reference for demonstration in other regions. Since this is only an analysis of one area, I think that if we properly reflect the opinions of various experts and people here, more various knowledge can actually be incorporated. This time, it is still at the demonstration level, so when I go to implementation, I am thinking about how it can develop when I think about Society5.0 and the society that will emerge in the future.

On the far left side, there are no squares, but they are circles and triangles. First of all, the reason why this is working so well is that Mr. Miyashiro told me at the beginning that this is how we are actually doing it overseas. I think this is exactly what we are doing.

One point that I thought was good was actually the "selection of use cases." It was divided into about three levels like Mr. Nagumo, but I pressed it from the bottom. In other words, everyone thinks that negative desires and desires close to latent desires must be satisfied, so I feel that I am setting a purpose that everyone agrees on, which is to eliminate this negative rather than to make it positive. As I explained, if elderly people return their licenses, they have to leave the area. If we do something about this, no one can oppose it. We set a very important Issue first, and then we cycle through the main bases in the use cases. It is a small range, but we can select a very important region.

Next, I would like to explain contextual analysis. This analytical method draws an analytical diagram of what is involved between the target system and the outside in the architecture. Using this analytical method, I will explain how the two points of "quick and small implementation" and "good use cases selection" affect each other. I believe that there are opponents and supporters among the people around us, but since we have selected a good use cases, it is difficult to oppose and it is easy to agree. In addition, the more successful this is, the more the percentage of supporters will increase, so it is good to start from there. In addition, by taking out insurance, we are also doing a set of suppressing the place where negative things always appear, and it is very difficult for the opponents to promote such things, so I think we are putting in a mechanism to suppress this and increase the number of supporters.

In addition, value and money are now well balanced in the form of subsidies and Benefit-Your-Locality Hometown Tax. We are operating it well, but we didn't know if we were taking money from users, so the value cycle is now drawn with a dotted line, but it is like this now because it is a demonstration. When we set this as the first step, what we did in the second step was "increase the number of users," that is, increase the number of use cases. So, this is also successful, and we start with a place where everyone absolutely agrees, and we think we can do something, and we can increase the number of users who can be used for this or that, and increase the number of use cases. This will be steadily progressing. This will be absolutely necessary in the future, and the more users we have, of course, the more clearly the impact of the pros and cons will be, so we will increase the number of users, increase the pros, and decrease the cons. This is also working well.

In addition, if the number of users increases, I can imagine that the revenue of users will increase in the future, although they may not receive any money now, so there will be more people who will pay money to use it. I thought that the method of increase in use cases was amazing, and it is true that there is a major route to Tokyo, and there was talk of a facility at the level of the World Games. I can imagine that if there is such a facility, people who move to it and people who come to it will use it, and I think I can do it well in such a way.

The talk of regulation mitigation will lead to a reduction in operating expenses. In the end, the last key to this kind of thing is, as you all know, if we do this in area, the money will not be balanced, so in the end, this will collapse and we will not be able to do it well. We must always think about how to increase our revenue while increasing our number of partners and how to reduce our expenditure. It is working well that this is working well. So, I think it will be a great reference for how to choose and expand.

In the future, I thought about it on my own, and when I promote it to implementation, cooperation and digital, which is the keyword this time, I thought while analyzing this time that cooperation and digital can be used very much. What is it? First of all, when I think about increasing the number of users and the purpose of use, cooperation can be used to increase the number of users. What is it? I talked about returning my license earlier, but there are so many people who don't want to return their licenses as an option. I think I will use it even before returning my license, like I will use mobility in my town together, like I will become a user. This is completely cooperation. So, rather than paying for it because of the need, I will make it like mobility in our town, and in the end, I will use it. In addition, if it proceeds, I will be able to use it as I want even if I return my license. The number of use cases I use must be increasing, but if the number of use cases is increasing, if it is okay to use only this, they will return it, and it will be natural to use it.

Then, in terms of increasing the number of other use cases to be used, in the example earlier, I explained mobility and health care when I explained the architecture, but in the end, the connection between various things has become possible through digital cooperation. If we create a digital connection that is exactly what Society5.0 aims to achieve, we will be able to do more and more things that can be used elsewhere. So, we will do that. By increasing the number of purposes through cooperation and digital cooperation, the number of users will increase, the number of positive ones will increase, and the number of negative ones will decrease. Of course, this will go down, and money will flow from the users to the operator in the value cycle. Then, in the value balance, the usage fee will increase, and the revenue will increase. So, I think we should definitely do one thing.

The other is about the mechanism and architecture. It would be good if we could reduce this. For example, I think that share is one of these. Infrastructure construction costs are reduced by using share, or operation costs are reduced by sharing operation. Share is used digitally. Infrastructure cooperation is done digitally, or cross-linking is done digitally. Through mutual cooperation, expenditures are reduced.

In the end, I have been thinking about how to maintain a balance of value. First of all, digital and cooperation will increase revenues and reduce expenditures. The other is, although it has not been mentioned until now, there are many cases where there are competitors. In the case of mobility, which is originally located in area, bus operators and taxi operators who were in charge of transportation will not be able to survive. This will also be a problem. What should be done about them? In this section, it is written as competition, but competition will be eliminated from competition. In other words, this is also mutual assistance, but in the end, if we use a competing company as an operating parent company, we can protect their employment. In the case of implementation, it is OK to be led by local government, but we will create a local mobility and a company that supports transportation together. By having them come in and ensuring the continuity of employment, we will eliminate competition from competition. This will also create an operating company.

In the end, this is close to just an idea, but in the end, I feel that it does not work if it is only a usage fee, and how to bring in money that is not a usage fee, of course, there is something like Benefit-Your-Locality Hometown Tax, but what is completely different is that there seem to be various examples here, and everyone wants to know what they know. For example, in this example, Mr. Sakaimachi has a world-class place and sports facility, and he can operate it without spending money in a PFI way. If the parent organization of that and the parent organization of this are the same, the profit of the other party can be offset by the profit of this party.

There are people in the countryside who are doing similar things in private sector, and a company called Yamagata Design is doing something in Shonai. They are building a facility where children of school children can play. The operating expenses of the facility are covered by a power sales company. They are the same company, and they make up for it with their profits. The point is not to contract electricity directly with area Electric Power Company, but to do it through the company. At that time, the people of area were saying, "They are doing a good thing for area, so please turn on the electricity here." So, although they are not doing any business at all, more and more people in area are signing contracts with the power company, and their profits actually account for half of the operation of the school children. So, only half the fee is enough. Thinking about it this way, there is electricity and gas, which is called infrastructure, in each area. So, if we can create an intermediary company for each area and use the profits generated by the intermediary company for the operation of the infrastructure of, it will surely raise the bottom of profits. Therefore, I think that such wisdom is being worked on by various people in the countryside, and if we collect such wisdom, we will be able to create such a cooperative business well, not only for the usage fee, but also for the infrastructure supported by area and the business supported by area. I thought that such a business could be built well for the future.

So, with the image that it will be a steady sales, and with that in mind, the problems that are occurring in area, which are very difficult to cover only with usage fees, will become a little easier to solve. So, in the final summary, as I just explained, I talked about what architecture is, how Sakaimachi is doing well, and what should be done for implementation.

That's all.

Chairman Ishida: : Thank you very much.

Mayor Hashimoto, do you have any comments?

Member: Thank you, .

Thank you very much, Dr. Shirasaka.

Today, I think that Mr. Nagumo's and Mr. Shirasaka's are very excellent indicators for local government, and for a small local government. For example, I am saying that various visits are always made to Sakaimachi. There are 1,741 heads of local governments throughout Japan, and there are many who follow the precedent, so I am wondering if Issue actually exists in local government.

I had an election in February, and I usually collect data on marketing in my election, so I took a look at automated driving as well. When I took a look at the pros and cons of automated driving, it was 50 to 50. Surprisingly, there was a lot of opposition. But actually, when I analyzed it, there were a lot of people who didn't know what it was. The point is that if only 500 million yen was released in the first five years, it would be 100 million yen a year, but if I invested 500 million yen, there were a lot of people who didn't know what it was, so the people who actually benefited from it were good. People in rural areas who didn't benefit from it were opposed because they didn't know what it was. On the other hand, in order to counteract this, I always make materials to counteract it, but I made new leaflets saying how effective it was, how cost-effective it was in the town, and how much subsidies I had received, and I distributed them all. As a result, the opposition to automated driving decreased significantly. Therefore, there were many people who opposed it because they didn't know about it, so I thought it would be good for the residents to explain it very thoroughly because it would benefit them.

Teacher, I was so grateful for the idea of the place where the money goes around that I mentioned earlier. In fact, we always create a joint stock company. For example, a solar joint stock company operates two mega-companies, and we first created a joint stock company and put all two mega-companies on the roofs of public facilities. That was about seven years ago. Now, we donate about 20,000,000 yen to the town every year, and I am the president of the company. There is a joint stock company like that, and we also created a public corporation called the Town Development Public Corporation. Usually, we create a third sector and fail. In our case, we left the operation of various roadside stations and so on to the Tourist Association, and sales increased, and we created the Town Development Public Corporation. The company started seven years ago with three people, but now there are about 147 people and sales are about 3,300,000,000. So, in local government, which has 24000 people and a budget of about 7,000,000,000, there are two companies that increase sales that much. local government, which has people and a budget of about, there are two companies that increase sales that much.

Now, there are various companies of area Electric Power Company. The system in which everyone goes around is difficult, so I would like to refer to it by all means. At an early stage, as the current subsidies and hometown tax payment dependence plus are recognized in area, the profits from them will be put into this company. Therefore, I thought it would be better to create a new company, but I thought I would do such a thing at an early stage.

Your analysis and various ways of transferring money were very helpful, so I am grateful. Thank you very much.

Chairman Ishida: , please.

Member Momota: In the sentence of Otsu on page 2 of : Thank you very much.

I felt that the perspective of the system of systems is similar to that of mobility. One is the service car in automated driving, the public transportation, the owner car, and the passenger car. It is natural that the purpose of the service car is easy to set. You talked about the purpose of the owner car and mutual assistance, but more than that, as you said, the purpose has increased in the first place. Lifestyle changes are occurring a lot, especially during the COVID-19 pandemic, so even the architecture is quite difficult. I think it is difficult to set the purpose itself. In particular, when mobility is held on the topic of mutual assistance, there are many stories based on the premise of the owner car, such as sharing, so is it complicated, or will it work if a consensus can be obtained in society?

Another point was about the industrial structure of mobility. The biggest thing in this industry is the separation of manufacturing and sales, which I often say. As everyone in the Japan Automobile Manufacturers Association is here today, automobiles are a manufacturing industry, and manufacturers are a manufacturing industry and a wholesale industry. What ordinary people in area, private sector, think of as automobile companies are all local sales companies. In this discussion of MaaS, when we talk about systems, dealers are practically not involved. There are some people who are doing businesses in various regions, such as in Kanagawa, that have a strong impact on their own. When we discuss this, we have more automobile dealers, and there are various individual strategies, such as Toyota, but if we try to make more of them, it will be even more difficult to distinguish cooperative areas and competitive areas among dealers. Systems of Systems is also subject to various restrictions, but as a person who has been watching the field for a long time, it will be really difficult to put them into effect. However, I had the impression that I had to do it. Thank you very much.

Shirasaka: Is it the .

I think you are right about the first point. Therefore, basically, if you set the purpose in the architecture, it will inevitably become an image of creating a certain fixed or solid thing from the top down. Instead, in this case, I think it is a way of creating a variety of things by setting the purpose that it is easy for various people to enter and connect. If not, as you say, the purpose will increase, the number of stakeholders will increase, and there will be difficulties in that regard. Therefore, I think it is necessary to make the architecture not a solid type but a type in which various things will be born. I think you are right.

The second point is that I believe that is true, but since I do not know much about it, I believe that there are many experts and people involved in this area, and if it is actually carried out, I believe that it is necessary to hold discussions while including such people. Thank you very much.

Chairman Ishida: , Apollo is very clear. Since then, the world has changed a lot, but the purpose itself is incomprehensible. At such a time, I think it is easy for Mr. Nagumo's Well-Being to be shared for a purpose that can be sympathized with. What are the characteristics of Mr. Shirasaka's System of Systems when such a purpose is set?

Shirasaka: Is it the .

I think that's a very good way to do it. In fact, as I have been talking with Mr. Nagumo for a long time, I think that using Mr. Nagumo's indicators, what kind of town you want to have will differ from town to town. Therefore, I think that the purpose of the set is to Taimi which indicators and how. However, it is also highly abstract, so it is one approach to make it possible for people to do various things toward it.

Therefore, as a purpose setting, when I do it in smart cities, I will do it on that side, but in the end, only when various people bring together various ideas and various services come out like mushrooms after rain, will I be able to live in various ways without leaving various people behind. I think it is necessary to have more options and more variety, and I can make design of such a system. Therefore, I think it is a way of making it on that side. However, as a measure, it is possible to create a key thing that leads to this in a top-down manner, so I think it will be a set with that.

What I am talking to Mr. Nagumo is that we are using Mr. Nagumo's indicators to hold workshops and think about what various people can do toward that. We are trying to do various things together, and I would like to create a system in which various ideas will come out at the citizen level and the local government level, and many of them will come out.

Chairman Ishida: I see. They themselves have something to do well.

Shirasaka: Is it the It is close to it.

Chairman Ishida: I feel that the boundary between becoming smarter from now on and local government is melting away.

Shirasaka: Is it the That's right.

Chairman Ishida: ?

Shirasaka: Is it the I think we have to go that way from now on.

Mr. Kawabata: The term " First of all, I think this is in the middle of Dr. Shirasaka's presentation, and I think it is about whether we can expand horizontally in all area in the future. During my visit, I think how to select use cases and whether we can expand horizontally will have a great influence, but I thought it was difficult to select use cases, so I asked you about it. I thought it would be best to select the latter, which you just mentioned, so that we can propose many use cases, and implementation is easy, and if it is difficult, we can choose use cases with a low barrier to entry and try it. I thought design would be best.

Shirasaka: Is it the That's right. In addition, in response to Mr. Nagumo's indicator, where does this town aim? If there is such a thing as this, which is extremely terrible to analyze and aim at, as the committee member said earlier, I think that selecting it is very much a sense of satisfaction that everyone must do it. The reason why I thought Sakaimachi was very good at listening to the story is that there is no such pane as elderly people have to move out, so I think that such a big pane is a very good target selected when the town has to do something about it.

Mr. Kawabata: The term " because I thought that part was really clear. I thought that what was missing was, in the end, a lack of goals, and I also found that the goal of design and the target of design were extremely difficult.

Chairman Ishida: , please.

Hidaka Member: Thank you, Mr. Shirasaka .

There is a gap between the current situation and the situation where MaaS came out and automated driving came out before the novel coronavirus. To put it the other way around, I think the usability of architecture is being reviewed now. The reason is that there are good stories to reinforce that we need to do things differently from before. This time, I will talk about transportation in a digital transportation society, so I think there is also a story about the automobile industry. In terms of transportation, the population is decreasing, and it is not possible to spend the profits made from inbound tourism due to the novel coronavirus on area costs, and negative revenue and expenditure are announced for railways, and applications have been made for the disuse of buses. In that case, it is time to review the architecture itself, which has developed transportation as an industry, as a transportation industry. Within the Ministry of Land, Infrastructure, Transport and Tourism, there is a review committee on the redesign of area transportation, and the top and bottom separation of buses and automobiles. Transportation is not only about buses and railways, but also about how to ensure mobility and mobility, including car sharing and the provision of private cars. I think we need to discuss this urgently, especially within the Japanese government. I don't know if it is within this framework or if it is a deep story, but I think it is a very significant timing to connect it with Well-Being, so I think it would be good to include that perspective.
Shirasaka: Is it the .

It is important, but there is something that is not very clear today. When we make a design for the architecture, we actually put in place prerequisites for the design. In many cases, we do this unconsciously, but what you pointed out is that the prerequisites have actually changed. For example, we thought it was natural for a large number of inbound tourists to come to Japan due to the novel coronavirus, but they suddenly stopped coming, so we clearly made the premise, analyzed the impact, and made a design again. It is actually something that needs to be done, but we did not include that today, although it is very important and I usually say it is very important, but we did not include it today.

SUDA Member: I'm Suda from University of Tokyo. Thank you very much for listening to your very interesting story today.

I am also involved in technology, especially hardware, so from that point of view, I think that the quality of mobility and services will be affected by the quality of technology. However, I think it is necessary to create a story that covers digital mobility, rather than discussing it only in terms of technology.

Furthermore, in terms of technology, the members here are more concerned with transportation companies and manufacturing. In the automobile industry, for example, in mobility as a whole, they are concerned with repair shops, gas stations, and charging stations for EVs. I thought that we would need to hold discussions that include such areas.

Shirasaka: Is it the :

Member: I'm Yamamoto from ITS Japan.

I would like to return to the previous slide. In use cases, we were actually supported by Toyota Motor Corporation until a little more than one year ago. When we do business, we are aware of use cases. This is because it is a service of mobility. What is a service? Is it to provide good value to customers? What is the purpose of that? One page before, Mr. Nagumo, is page 37, and there are such use cases for various purposes such as health, and for that reason, the service of mobility, which is a transportation area, is called into question. Mr. Kawabata said that it is very difficult to choose use cases. Under the big policies of Mr. Ito, such as centralization of design, helping the countryside, and raising children, we focus on health. When is done in a way that use cases is here and this countryside is, the first, second, and third times, Public-Private ITS Concept and Roadmap or digital transportation strategies, strategies are about where resources are spent and processes are created. I tried to organize my head.

Shirasaka: Is it the

SAITO Member: , I first started various things in smart cities. In the end, I decided to select a town that suits each local government and revitalize the residents toward it. That will lead to infrastructure. I thought it was a town development like that, and the main focus was on QOL, but it wasn't Well-Being. That's where I started. After a while, I wasn't talking about GAFA right now, but in SNS and Facebook, there were stories about people who were isolated among humans and that they also had to be saved. Recently, I've been talking about human-centered and thinking about various things, so I think today's story is a very good one.

However, I have been thinking about how to collect data in the sense of reflecting it in policies in each EBPM. If we do not design these things together, there will be good mayors like Mr. Hashimoto in each town, and we will have to catch the facts in order to do business there. I felt that how to catch them is one Issue.

Professor Shirasaka's story in the second half is that I am also working on the System of Systems, and I understand it well. As you said earlier, the system is a layer structure, and it gradually accumulates from the base. In the end, what kind of service will be provided to the user will be the people of each servicer. Probably, the people of local government will also come out, so the structure itself will have a common layer at the foot.

I thought that we had to think about such things. What is necessary is that if various local government and various business operators start to build them individually, as a result, if they build them on various independent routes, they will not be connected horizontally and will be separated. So, for example, if we talk about transportation of layers, if there is actually a talk about green, there will be a talk about EVs or hydrogen stations. If we do not have a way to handle these things together, they will be optimized individually and will not be completed well in the end. While imagining this, I heard that it is necessary to listen to the needs of users first, grasp the vertical axis of use cases, think about the vertical axis, assume a so-called layer structure, and cut each of them.

Murase Member: Thank you very much for the wonderful story.

Our company also started to talk about Well-Being, and since we are a manufacturer, we can measure blood flow by facial recognition and measure the individual happiness of the person, but it is quite difficult to measure blood flow and so on, and it is wonderful to be able to do it in a statistical and logical manner.

As I listened to your talk today, on page 37, in the picture I have been talking about, each city, town, and local government has its own needs. Some of them do not satisfy the physiological needs of the means of transportation I mentioned earlier, and some of them desire self-transcendence. So, I understood that each design will be located in each place. Now, when you say that this will be included in the roadmap, how will it be written in the roadmap? What I was glad to hear from Mr. Shirasaka today is that only the way will be decided. As I mentioned earlier, how and in what time we will create a common infrastructure system, and a great person like Mr. Hashimoto will come out, and while using that tool, new things will be created in each region, area, and area. I thought that was the roadmap. I was a little worried about where I would go if I continued like this, but I had a sense of understanding. Thank you very much for your talk today.

Advisor Mr. Ito: I would like to introduce just one example of a system of systems in . When it comes to MaaS, I was looking only at Finland, but Mr. Ishida invited me to participate in the efforts of an international organization called ITF, and I learned that Denmark is working on something quite advanced. Five major area transportation operators have jointly established a company and created a common platform for on-demand transportation, and more than 550 area transportation operators seem to be using the system to provide services. What is amazing about this system is that it covers not only general on-demand transportation, but also transportation such as hospital transportation, school transportation, and nursing care transportation. When a transportation operator provides hospital transportation, the cost is covered from medical care expenses, and the settlement of the cover can be made on this system.

In addition, in rural areas, there is always a shortage of beds, and it is difficult to increase the number of beds, so we arrange a large bus to transport several people together so that they can receive medical care at a hospital in an urban area. I think this mechanism is an example of the system of systems standardization that Mr. Shirasaka and Mr. Saito mentioned, and I would like to share it for your reference.

Chairman Ishida: .

I would like to summarize briefly at the end. Today, how to build the mobility system and how to build the architecture. I don't know if it is rude to say that it is a tool for actual execution, but I think it is a very important component. It was very significant that everyone formed a certain common understanding about it.

As Mr. Saito mentioned, the question of how digital will be involved in policy and implementation is exactly the question. System analysis used to be a failure in social infrastructure and comprehensive planning, so I received a very flexible and fresh idea that the method itself is the purpose and the purpose is to improve the purpose. I am very glad. In this way, the approach and system analysis using digital in the new era or based on green, although it is not very clear yet, I feel that I am beginning to see such a thing. Thank you very much.

I would like to conclude the presentations by the two of you. There is one more important thing. The study group will issue a report, and there is a draft outline of the Digital Transportation Society Promotion Strategy. I would like to hear your opinions on that as well.

Please tell me briefly about this outline.

Secretariat: I would like to briefly introduce you.

This is a summary including the two discussions so far, the talk I received this time, and the materials.

First of all, with regard to the "Introduction", as Director Saito mentioned earlier and as Mr. Murakami has already mentioned, I would like to have a direction in which various things work in sync with each other, based on the idea of thinking about things from the perspective of human beings. I would like to describe the Issue setting of the first Study Group, which I would like to think about from the demand side, not the supply side and the technology side. I would like to summarize the cases that have been introduced twice so far, and I would like to start by saying that this is what is happening in the world.

In addition, regarding specific initiatives with horizontal deployment in mind, as you discussed a lot today, I would like to extract a little bit of what kind of efforts are being made and what kind of learning is possible when expanding horizontally.

In addition, with regard to III, there were discussions today about what we should do going forward, what goals we should set, and what we should follow in terms of strategies. Based on today's discussions, we will build a base so that various things can be done, and I think it is the same story that we will build a transportation part of infrastructure from use cases. We will do such things. When I think about doing such things, I think it is necessary to set goals properly, as a mechanism to decide what we should set as goals, while keeping Well-Being in mind. Such things are written in III. Last week's draft was quite different from today's discussion, and based on today's discussion, with my own understanding, I believe that such things are appreciated in today's discussion.

In addition, regarding IV, there are various efforts being made by the Government, such as those being made by Vision for a Digital Garden City Nation, the Ministry of Land, Infrastructure, Transport, and Tourism, and the Ministry of Economy, Trade and Industry, so I would like to sort out what is being discussed at which layer.

It would be great if we could write down what we will do specifically in the end after looking at these points as a whole. However, rather than that, we would like to decide on a meta story about how we will think about it. As Murakami said at the beginning, I believe that this is the first step in connecting the upper body and the lower body, and I believe that this is the goal.

Since we are thinking in such a structure, we would appreciate it very much if you could give us various opinions and include this element.

Chairman Ishida: , please.

Katsumaki Member: , I would like to ask if there are any examples of success in connecting places where MaaS or other technologies have not been developed. There are quite a few things that can be done in cooperative areas, and many companies are entering the country on-going. To be honest, I have yet to understand what the roles of the government will be in connecting them. If only one company is supported, competitors will be destroyed. In many cases, if there are two or more competitors, it will be difficult to understand what they are doing. Please tell us if you have any ideas on how to realize connectivity within the time frame.

Shirasaka: Is it the .

Unfortunately, I don't have any specific ideas about what I should do, but I think that's exactly where we have to make it based on your knowledge. What is really good? It will be a hypothetical, so I think it will be how to validation the hypothetical. Actually, when you make what you want to do, and go toward it, then, to be honest, I think where to choose from is what I mentioned earlier. In choosing a use cases, in the end, when I think that I want to do what I want to do in the distant future, when I think that I can do what I want to do if there are many more various people and various things are connected, like the example of Denmark, I think in logic, but I don't know if it is really good, so I think that when I get to it, this area, this area, how many companies will do it? However, as Director Saito said earlier, this is cut into vertical use cases, so I actually do this in two or three places, and while looking at it from the side, I wonder what it will be like to connect things. I think about creating a use case drive on the vertical side, like cutting what I want to do with layers on the horizontal side, and how to do it on the horizontal side when connecting them, and I somehow feel that it will be done in parts. Ukami

Katsumaki Member: Even if you actually advance the architecture too much in your mind from the beginning, it will advance more and more over time.

Shirasaka: Is it the That's right.

Katsumaki Member: In this discussion, I think it is very good to create small success stories as use cases, so who will call on us to do this on a horizontal basis?

Shirasaka: Is it the Digital Agency or the DADC? What do you think?

SAITO Member: Basically, DADC makes products at the request of somewhere, and it does not decide them by itself. It approaches by gathering experts and submitting them to general companies around the world and receiving their opinions. So, taking the example of Denmark as use cases, for example, let's think about an architecture that can do this in a certain aggregate, with each service provider. I think this is one model.

Therefore, in a sense, we want to create a society like this, and there will be such an aggregate and platform. If we make assumptions, we will make assumptions, and there will be various servicers for the services necessary for it. We will not fix it, but will allow various people to enter it. This is the architecture we want to create. In a sense, our basic idea is to aim for an architecture in which various people can participate and develop, rather than having a separate image. In that case, we may take a use cases, but we will not support it somewhere, and we will be able to realize it by allowing everyone to use it in an open manner. What should we think about it?

Member Koda: As you said, when creating a consortium, the idea of having only those companies with a large number of mobility industries participate is different from what Mr. Miyashiro said. If the consortium is centered on consumers, I think it is a feeling that facilities and industries that are often used by consumers will not be included in the consortium that properly considers this mobility. Exactly what AsMama is doing is this cooperative areas. In area, probably in each area, where hospitals think only about hospitals, parking lots think only about parking lots, and pharmacies think only about pharmacy, people can tell people in cooperative areas that there is a pharmacy there and there is a midwife. It is closer to 4.5 than Society5.0, but we can tell them various options by word of mouth and digital. If cooperative areas matures firmly, it will become a channel, and it will become a business as a channel and media. So, if cooperative areas, which Dr. Shirasaka talked about earlier, will become a business, it will be a business.

However, in this cooperative areas, when we first ask who the benefit is, it is the common benefit for the area. Therefore, it is difficult to understand the benefit of some industry at the beginning, so I think the role of the government in this digital transportation society is to discuss who will be prepared to bear the cost burden and the time frame burden that you are saying.

Chairman Ishida: , please.

Miyashiro Member: , I began to be particularly concerned about the residents' acceptance and the words they often say, and I feel that what I do because I am involved in it, beneficial to me, or important to me is different from acceptance. For example, in the case of "One Minute City," which I introduced in Sweden, from the moment a resident says that the road is his or her own, elementary school students also take it as their own, and the level of taking it as their own will change depending on the position of the person and the habits of life. But what the local government and the business operator must do is how to make the target take it as their own. Therefore, by writing in a way that goes beyond acceptance, I wonder if it will cheer up each place. I think that the expression of acceptance should be a little bit more concerned and a little bit more inter-site expression.

Chairman Ishida: 's self-reliance is wonderful, but Ukraine is also self-reliant, Fukushima is also self-reliant, mobility is also self-reliant, and highways are also self-reliant. When everything is self-reliant, no matter how many bodies you have, it's not enough for you as a citizen. Such a problem is a little worrying.

Miyashiro Member: , I think it is my own thing in my life. If you include it in Well-Being and take it as my own thing in it, it will be quite close.

Chairman Ishida: What should be the approach to make it so that it will spring up instead of being forced to do its own thing?

Secretariat: That's the role of the administration. I have to explain that it has something to do with Mr. Nagumo's wife, otherwise I won't be able to take care of myself. But even if I tell him to think about it because it's his own business, he won't think about it.

Member Koda: As you said, when creating a consortium, the idea of having only those companies with a large number of mobility industries participate is different from what Mr. Miyashiro said. If the consortium is centered on consumers, I think it is a feeling that facilities and industries that are often used by consumers will not be included in the consortium that properly considers this mobility.

Chairman Ishida: In that sense, there are about seven items on the first page of Material 7. I think the issue of how to create a community that Mr. Koda mentioned or sent out by e-mail is very important from his own point of view, and I would like you to add such a matter.

Mr. Kawabata: The term " mutual assistance" has a dangerous part, and there is a possibility that I will not be the main body because I think someone will do it. So, I think the term "mutual assistance" itself is very good and should be used, but at the same time, it is also very important to clarify who will benefit. For example, even if I write that the bank is beneficial, if I use the bank, if the bank is beneficial, then I will also be beneficial. So, including familiar industries, mobility may be like only automobile related industries. For example, I think the term "social acceptance" will eventually fall into the term "social acceptance." When digitalization mobility and changing the system or design again, for example, what I use, convenience stores may be beneficial, banks may be beneficial, and people may be beneficial. By narrating it in a narrative, the residents' acceptance will eventually increase, and it will become a main body. It is not the morals of the residents, but the benefits are understood as a result.

Basically, the Japanese government studies various things and accumulates figures through industry, but it tends to produce figures that are intended to solve problems through the morals of the people. So, as you said, everyone is tired. In the end, there will definitely be a response that the people's morals are good. In that sense, after clarifying the benefits of corporations, individuals, and local government communities, we will create a narrative story. As a result, the psychological situation in which we should do something because it is beneficial is not moral, but moral in terms of, for example, reducing CO2 emissions. I think it is best not to appeal to moral.

Member Momota: In the sentence of Otsu on page 2 of , "For a social implementation with a sense of speed, it is also effective to set an appropriate implementation unit (from wide-area cooperation to local government unit), and to have roles such as an intermediate support organization that coordinates industry, government, academia, and the private sector with continuity," I would like to ask what an intermediate support organization is. For example, at the area Transportation Conference, there are many discussions about what to do with the classic bus stops in public transportation, and there are many area where there are few discussions. There are some places such as Musashino City where there are very substantial discussions, and there are some places where there are almost no discussions. The Eiheiji-cho MaaS Conference that I am visiting is a MaaS Conference, so it is not a conference only on transportation. As Mr. Koda says, we will have various teachers participate in the conference, but it is difficult to talk about transportation. It is easy at first, but if we dig deeper, it is easy to finish the discussion somewhere, so how to continue this is, for example, if there is a place where everyone can feel free to enter online, or a small working group of the study group, or if it is not concrete, it will be difficult to discuss continuously in area, so I think this is a big key. I think so from actual experience.

Member of Nagumo: infrastructure is particularly difficult. Traffic, roads, and so on. What I thought I came to in Mr. Shirasaka's discussion earlier was that the German Berke Stadt came up. I think that is close, but if I do it, it will be said to be a third sector. Therefore, in the organization theory, what is good Japanese cooperation? If it does not come up, it will probably be in the form of someone else's affairs. If it comes to one's own business, it will become self-realization and close to Well-Being, but it will be rotated in the opposite direction, and it will become a's dilemma. I feel that what to do here is the biggest issue.

Chairman Ishida: In that sense, although the current situation is severe due to the high price of oil and other resources, I believe that the electric power company has great potential as a Stadt Berke. In that sense, it is possible to combine mobility and energy.

Member of Nagumo: , I think that's probably where Japanese companies are. I think the solution is to create a platform for utility systems and mobility. I think there is no other way to be a platformer. At such a time, if there is no self-reliance, or if there is no place to be close to the common people's sense, I feel that it will be like an incorporated administrative agency or a third sector.

Secretariat: In the National Comprehensive development Plan of the former National Land Agency, there is a discussion that a new local management corporation should be created, and it is necessary to have an entity that can make decisions together and can operate independently to a certain extent. Tomiyama-san has been recommended for a long time.

SAITO Member: I think we will need such a thing someday. We don't have it now. Otherwise, we can't realize it in such a way by using digital technology. We can't do it as it is. We may not have it, but I think we have no choice but to propose such a thing.

Member of Nagumo: Boku is translated as Platform Co-operativism, but it is also one of area management such as Stadt Berke and BID. If the landowner cleans his own place, I think it is a sense that there is no main body unless we design something like a hybrid around here.

Miyashiro Member: FDC is very involved in people, involves and connects various parties, and plays the role of an agent that creates something new. A platform is also necessary, but I often feel that a combination of such agents and catalytic activities is necessary in the Japanese case. Even if there is only a platformer, it does not work at all, and even if there is only an agent, it does not seem to be systematized at all. However, it is probably difficult to create a party that can do both, so it may be possible to do them separately. It may be a transition. Anyway, it is difficult to run the system while moving the site at the same time, even if only one party becomes an intermediate organization. I feel that there will be at least several more years.

Chairman Ishida: , I have two requests regarding Material 7. It says "Draft Outline of Strategies for Promotion of a Digital Transportation Society" in the title. I would appreciate if you could keep the wording in this direction. As it was mentioned at the end, Public-Private ITS Concept and Roadmap at the bottom of page 2 is actually the predecessor. ITS is Intelligent Transportation System, and the official Japanese translation is Intelligent Transport System. It has a certain logic, but ITS strongly inherits the feeling of an automobile road. In the way we have been discussing ITS, we need to take into account people's lives and Well-Being in a comprehensive manner. In that sense, I thought that a digital transportation society would have a new feeling. I would like you to think about whether or not it is okay to go in that direction.

In addition, for example, at the top of page 3, it is written that there are medical care and welfare, shopping, education, and commuting and work. All of these are human activities. When we say mobility, the flow of goods is absolutely necessary for the industries that support our lives. Therefore, we have not discussed distribution yet, so I cannot write about it, but I think there are many other such things. I think it is better to leave such things for future discussion to the extent that can be imagined now. I will do it again next time.

Secretariat: Yes, I will.

Chairman Ishida: If you could send us something like this, such as something missing or something like that, I think this strategy would work well. So, I'm sorry that I don't have much time today, but I would like you to take it home and visit us next time. Thank you very much.

Thank you for your time.

Secretariat: We look forward to your support for the fourth session.

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